"Choosing" to be big? Not necessarily.

[firecat]

I don't think most people can subconsciously control their weight for psychological reasons. Scientists have done studies of twins (raised together and apart) and their weight is usually very similar even if they have different lifestyles and had different upbringings. The conclusion to a study like this is that weight has a very large genetic component.

I'm uncomfortable with the notion that most people are subconsciously choosing their weight, because that implies if you are big, there is something wrong with your head.

There are enough people who think there is something wrong with my body because I'm big. I don't really want them to all think there is something wrong with my head too!

Relating it to sexual orientation: At one time I had all sorts of psychological theories about why I couldn't make up my mind whether to be with men or women. Then a smart therapist said "Maybe you're just bi." I realized all my theories were unnecessary -- I didn't have to make a choice.

In other words, having plausible psychological theories about why one is big doesn't necessarily mean that's why one is big. It means that one feels the need to justify being big. That's understandable in a society that believes there is something wrong with being big.

Comments

[feline.livejournal.com]

True.

I know I'm uncomfortable when I'm thin. To be honest, I don't like being thin. Even getting down to a 12/14 makes me uncomfortable. It doesn't feel right or like my body for some reason.

I also didn't like the attention I got when I was thin.

"Oh, she's wierd looking and she has a hot body, I bet she puts out."

I still get the wierd looking part, but thankfully no more getting hit on or assumed I'm some sort of sexual toy, well not usually anyhow.

Oh, and welcome to my friends list....

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

Being uncomfortable with being a sex object and wanting to be loved wholly for the "inner you" is a part of femininity I will only be able to understand on an intellectual level I am afraid. I wish I had the time/money for muscles, babe magnet toys, etc. Although, I currently don't have time/energy for a relationship either. on't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to be involved with jerk, but I admit to myself that things other than "smart" and "nice" matter. But then the social cost for admitting that is less for a guy (but not by much, I have gotten a few flames for admitting that in mixed company on the 'net)

[feline.livejournal.com]

Oh, I agree appearance does matter, but I'm not unattractive either. I'm actually quite striking, even at my weight, but a lot of that has to do with how I carry myself and how my appearance looks.

Nothing more striking than a chunky Native American chick with lots of earrings, purple streaks in her hair, and funkey red and black striped knee socks with an all black outfit...

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

Yeah, you were able to pull off a "Cheesecake" photo at that wieght and still look good. It took guts and attitude to do that. And yeah, that is just as important as the standard gauges of appearance.

[feline.livejournal.com]

Thanks....

As for guts and attitude...I think it's more just being comfortable with who I am as a person....

It's taken a lot to get where I am at this stage in my life. I spent a lot of time hating myself and thinking I was some sort of troll who should stay under a bridge. Even when I was some thin chick people drooled over, I had a horrible self image....

I'm not like that anymore. Now I like how I look and I like who I am as a person. Sure, I have flaws, but some does everyone.

As for the "mainstream" standards of beauty...screw 'em... I don't tend to agree with them anyhow...for women or men...

The women they claim as goddesses all too often are too skinny for my taste and the men often look terribly cookie cutter to me...

Then again, I prefer teddy bears as well as soft women....

[feline.livejournal.com]

Was just thinking about this...

The last 4 guys I've dated (keep in mind that I am polyamorous, so while I have been with my hubby for a year and a half there have been other people since I met him) were all ititially attracted to me for the way I look. I've not been a skinny chick in a few years. None of them were "chubby chasers" either. Of all of them, one has been a teddy bear (6'5", 300#), one was a very skinny waifish boi (6', 150#), one was a weight lifter (5'10", 250# of muscle), and there's my husband (5'9", 160#).

So, perhaps the male "standard" isn't quite as people would like it to be. I know my hubby wouldn't want me to be any other way than I currantly am, because what matters to him is I'm happy and he finds me amazingly attractive...

Oh, and I've only ever dated one woman who was skinny...out of the 7 I've gone out with in my life....

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

No, I don't think males are /quite/ as sterotyped and predictable as Hollywood types seem to think they are. Intangibles matter, although those intangibles aren't often any warmer and fuzzier than the better documented superficial stuff.

[firecat]

I wasn't all that uncomfortable at size 14 (a long time ago) but I do like the "twit filter" aspect of being larger.

Thanks, and likewise!

[feline.livejournal.com]

True on the twit filter, but I have to admit I still get a few of them (maybe one or two a day). Now, they think I'm desperate, not just easy...

[firecat]

How annoying.

Part of my twit filter is not dressing or carrying myself in a manner that attracts attention from strangers.

(Which is certainly not intended to be advice for you not to. I like it when people do! [Especially cute big chicks] It's just not particularly how I'm "wired", and it has advantages.)

[feline.livejournal.com]

I attract all kinds of attention from strangers. I used to try to do the blending in thing for a bit, but it didn't work. People still looked at me strangely.

I figured I may as well just give in and look strange and get it over with so they at least had a decent reason and I was having more fun.

Oh, and I'd notice you. I liked the pic I saw of you with the buzzed hair...heheh...you're cute...

[firecat]

blush!

Thanks!

Yes, people notice me when I have buzzed hair, but it's more the "staring" kind of noticing than the "hitting on" kind of noticing.

[feline.livejournal.com]

hehe. I have a thing for women with buzzed hair....

I tells me they have guts...and confidence is a big attraction for me...that and a sense of humor go a very long way...

[firecat]

I'm going to turn red from head to toe at this rate...

My buzz comes less from "guts" than from this "fuckit" attitude toward the whole daily fuss with your appearance thing.

I guess it takes guts to have such an attitude in this society.

What makes me lose confidence is not looking non-mainstream, but trying to look mainstream

The last time I tried to put on any makeup (for a reason other than a costume party)[B I burst into tears.
Let's just say that whenever I try to dress in a traditionally feminine manner I feel like I'm in drag.

[feline.livejournal.com]

The "fuckit" attitude in and of itself takes confidence. A lot of people never can shake thier head at the trivialities ebcause "what would the neighbors think?"

You don't need to look "mainstream". You're cute the way you are. There was a long period in my life when I didn't feel comfortable in anything other than my "drag king" outfits. Hell, I even bound my breasts down with sports bras and the like so I'd look more boyish. Even then, I still had people attracted to me.

Screw the make-up look if it doesn't work for you. You look great without it....

[firecat]

I generally don't feel the need to look "mainstream" or wear makeup. It was a much bigger issue when I was a kid because my mom really wanted me to be more feminine. Fortunately she has almost entirely gotten over this. She still doesn't like my buzzed hair. But that's OK, mom doesn't have to agree with me on everything.

I realized the other day that my body issues are different from those of a lot of women. A lot of women really don't like the way their own bodies look. I'm fine with the way I look when no one is pressuring me. Most of my body issues come from other people having a problem with my looks or from being frustrated that I can't do something physical I'd like to do.

You seem to share this attitude...I like that. It's too rare in women.

Drag king outfits... drool
I think gender-play is very hot.

[feline.livejournal.com]

My mom always accepted the way I looked, no matter what. It's something I really appreciate about her.

My body issues are the same. I really am not down on myself for the way I look, but it bothers the hell out of me when other people seem to disapprove or think I should look differently. If you damn well don't like how I look, don't stare and keep your freaking comments to yourself... (I got this attitude from my gramma)...

I love gender play...it's tons of fun...

When I had short hair I'd actually go to straight bars in drag and get girls' phone numbers, much to the chagrine of my male best friend. It bugged him because I almost always came home with more numbers than him.

I never had the nerve to call the girls though...was never sure if they realized I was a chick or not....

[firecat]

Hahaha! Your poor guy friend...

I've had the experience, online, of guessing someone's gender wrong. If I think it was a guy and it turns out to be a girl, I'm usually pleased. If I think it was a girl and it turns out to be a guy, I'm usually disappointed. Sometimes I feel weird about that. I mean, it's sexist. *gryn*

[feline.livejournal.com]

Heh. Hey, I'm the same way. Then again, I also get tired of men pretending to be women...

I usually scare them off though....

Being completely honest about your appearance does that...absolutely amazing....

[firecat]

I haven't run into too many men pretending to be women. (Well, if the first thing out of the supposed woman's mouth is "My measurements are 38" 25" 36" " then I strongly suspect it's not a woman.)

Yep, twit filter at work again.

[feline.livejournal.com]

I generally floor them and tell them honestly that I tend to find women of that frame less attractive....

when they ask why...

I tell them generally too thin...

that works as well.....

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

When I have time to indulge in such fantasies, non-het women are kinda a turnon for me. Although, it was kind of a bummer when I found out they have a whole different attraction symbology than het women. Some of the more femmish hybrids are kinda interesting, but full out butching....um....yuck.

[feline.livejournal.com]

hehe. I like some of the full out butches I meet, although I admit, I'm generally not one for all out lifestyle deisel dykes.

I also like some of the femmey chicks I meet...

It more a matter of personality with me than anything else...

A sense of humor, a unique sense of style, and confidence are a helluva lot more important to me than breast size...

Oh, and I'm not very attracted to too many skinny women. I like softness and curves....

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

All those things count. Sometimes I am not wholly sure what attracts me to one over another. I mean, ok, I have been attracted to some bombshells, but not every woman I have been attracted to has been a bombshell, and I am not attracted to /every/ bombshell. And believe it or not, not every brainy girl makes me think "Gee, if only she were good looking and wore makeup." Some /personalities/ just don't send me sexually, no matter how nice, brainy or attractive they are.
Of course, I haven't ever met anyone with /that/ good a resume either.

[feline.livejournal.com]

I don't think I've ever been attracted enough to just a simple picture to think that looks really do it for me. Even on a physical level, I'm much more likely to notice how someone stands than to notice the color of their eyes...

Then again...maybe that's why I'm bi...I'm more attracted to people rather than meat bodies...

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

That kinda fits the pattern of the bi women I have known. The bi women I have known usually have a pretty wide streak of non-conformity and really do indeed fall for the inner person.

Of course, from a dating perspective that wide streak of non-conformity is a double edged sword. Many times non-conformity becomes a kind of inverse bigotry (Hating anyone "normal" or belonging to an alternative group that has less room for interal differences than the average bowling league). Another issue from a long haul perspective is finding non-conformity and common sense in the same person, also a rarity. And falling for the inner person could be an issue if the het male involved needs a degree of "Outer" as well as "Inner" to be attracted, and they both had the ambition of agreeing on a person to add to the relationship.

Overall, they still are cool though.

[feline.livejournal.com]

*laugh*

Well, I certainly don't fall into the closed-minded category. I have a wide variety of people I like to socialize with. As long as a person accepts me for who I am and doesn't try to change me (we can have differing opinions to discuss, the person just has to realize they're about as likely to change me as I am them) and is honest, I tend to like to socialize with them. Variety is the spice of life.

People that are close enough to me to be considered family as well as friends particularly have a wide variety. There me with my very resolutely bisexual and polyamorous lifestyle as well as my good friend Father_rex (so named for his want to take care of everyone) who is Christian, believes homosexuality is wrong and monogomy is the only way to go. While I'm hunting for another permanent job, he's trying to figure out where my close knit group of friends can meet up in the world since he'll be doing missionary work in Ireland.

As for worrying about what my husband thinks of the woman, that doesn't matter to me as long as the two of them are friends. I'm in a wonderful relationship where if I want to find a girlfriend, I am welcome to, but my husband chooses to only be with me. He feels he can only love one person romantically and that person is me. So instead of having to agree on a third, if a woman came along who I had a good friendship with first and wanted to take it to the next level, I'd sit down and talk about it with him. If he was comfortable with it and her, then I'd persue something more.

I think I might be more blessed because of this than some other women are, but that's because my husband is secure with me. He knows I love him and a woman won't threaten that. He also is content with me. Maybe my relationship is just rare in that.

Anyhow, not all guys look at a bisexual woman and immediately think threesome, although they often seem rare. Also, not all men look at a bisexual woman and immmediately assume easy either. Despite what a lot of society tells us, I think that there are a lot more people out there who think like I do. They're just harder to find because rarely do they run around with the same voracity and with the same coverage...

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

Your association with father_rex encourages me. An "alternative" person without any Christian friends makes me wary.

As to your being a mixture of the offbeat and the conservative (bi, poly, presumably more willing to explore kinks, but still basically a "good girl"), hey that is *very* cool. My more conventional brother doesn't grok my interest in bi, sexually expressive women or my greater than average wariness about getting involved in a relationship. Sex involving other people is definitely sticking your neck out and the person I am doing it with had better both be a good bet in the character department and generate enough exitement to be worth the bother.

Thoughts on bi women in general:

I know threesomes are rare. Not all bi women are poly, not all bi, poly women are into threesomes, and even given a relationship with a bi, poly woman who thinks a thressome is the neatest thing since the GUI, Threesome 1.0 is hard software to download, install, configure and maintaintain. That is part of that gap between sex involving kleenex and sex involving other people (and schedules, responsibilities, personal issues, non-cooperative emotions, interpersonal politics, energy levels and other interests). I would still probably opt to try it if it came up though. Hey, ya only go around once and if looked at from a tired and wary enough perspective, very little in life would be worth the bother.

One nice thing about bi women in and of themselves and in the singular is the fact that (for some, not all) some of the more annoying parts of "femme" never took root on them. Het women often have to be 40ish and above before that happens. Bi women often have thought about their relationship to gender and are less inclined to get turned off by the fact I don't slavishly follow gender norms/stereotypes.

[feline.livejournal.com]

Curious what qualifies as a "good girl"...as by some definitions I'm certainly not one...

If you mean the fact that I don't drink alcohol, do drugs, or sleep with every person that comes along, I guess I'm a "good girl"...

Then again...

If you consider someone who snubs her nose at what society says she should be, has had group sex and attended parties for sole reason of finding a sexual partner, posts "cheesecake" and nudes to a website, and has even been an amateur BBW picture free site chick a "bad girl", then I guess I am one.

As for threesomes and group sex, my husband and I have already been down that road. It doesn't interest him as it is about as fulfilling to him as the average one-night stand, which feels incredibly empty to him. I've also see the look on his face and had discussions with him after. Taking him down that road doesn't interest me and empty sex lost it's thrill for me a while back. It was only fun because he was with me.

I think you've met more expressivley bi women than I have that aren't catty. Most of the ones I meet are just as catty as your average heterosexual. Then again, my experience with lesbians has been the same. And I hung out with several of them when I was in High School....

[feline.livejournal.com]

Bah...now it posts...wierd......

[xp85goblin.livejournal.com]

Ya gotta remember any definition of "good" coming from me is probably suspect to a lot of people. I have a strong streak of herecy. I think about my values and suprise, suprise, I often come to different conclusions than most people. If you derive your notion of what is right and wrong just based on "adherance to social norms", then I would be considered an amoral sociopath (or an maybe someone with a sense of ethics that are too demanding, and thus make people uncomfortable and angry(I never can tell, people on the 'net have acted toward me both ways at once in the same breath))

My experiance with Queer women has been mostly positive, although one girl who I dated briefly, and cared about, although really wasnt attracted to enough to sustain a relationship, had some pretty rotten experiences with her fellow Queer women after she was through dating me. Last time I saw her, she was pretty bitter. Possibly my good experiences come from the fact that my tendency toward herecy makes a pretty good twit filter. dunno.

As to your relationship with your husband, I find your attitude more understandable from my own frame of reference than his, although my brother has a similar attitude to your husband's. My attitude is, "If you are going to risk strong negative or just overly strong emotions, your finances, your health, your freedom and possibly your life and get in bed with someone, why not light the afterburner and break the sound barrier as it really doesn't cost that much extra risk or maintainance". But it sounds like your husband views sex as "an expression of love and commitment" rather than "rocket sled ride". I have gotten flames aplenty for my "rocket sled" paradigm for viewing sex. But then, I could end up married to someone with the "warm fuzzy" view of it myself....dunno...romance has very little to do with wisely wieghing options and tradeoffs and coming up with cost effective result. And it frustrates me no end.